Luuk Arens (asker) Jan 9, 2014:

Please submit answer @Barend, I quite like your proposal. Can you please submit it as an answer, so I can award KudoZ? Ta. Luuk

Barend van Zadelhoff Jan 7, 2014:

Or, for that matter ... Normaliter zou hij het hebben gedaan nadat hij met pensioen was gegaan, maar hij was vatbaar voor het idee om het toch maar meteen te doen. Zo is het gekomen.

'... perhaps ...

How did you leave the top of high-profile ING for the top of small player XX?

Kitty Brussaard Jan 7, 2014:

Or perhaps.. What made you swap your board position at (financial) giant ING for a new role at modestly-sized (company/organisation) XXX?

Laurens Sipahelut Jan 7, 2014:

Or, alternatively... How was it that you went from the top of a mountain that is ING to the top of some hill that is XXX?

Laurens Sipahelut Jan 7, 2014:

How was it that you went from... ... the top of Mount Everest that is ING to the top of some hill that is XXX?

Michael Beijer Jan 7, 2014:

@Andrew: In my opinion 'somewhat smaller' is incorrect.

Luuk said: '[a significantly smaller institution]'. If you translate this as 'a somewhat smaller organisation', you are mistranslating. Assumptions or no assumptions, this is simply wrong.

Michael Beijer Jan 7, 2014:

@Andrew: I think I see what you are trying to get at, but in a sense, every little step we take while translating is based on assumptions. I assume the author means X, Y, Z, etc. I suspect that trying to assume nothing at all while translating would eventually only lead to ... silence. ;)

Barend van Zadelhoff Jan 7, 2014:

Andrew My point is, all we can do, and that we actually do, is assuming.

Only through assuming we can approximate the 'truth' of the text.
There is no blind knowing, we always need to interpret.
This is the beauty of our craft.
To find out about the 'truth' of our texts.

Barend van Zadelhoff Jan 7, 2014:

The remark "the interviewer's question is neutral" is reading implied meaning into it.

For who says this remark is neutral?
And should it be necessarily neutral?

Andrew Howitt Jan 7, 2014:

DuuuHH! That's precisely what I wrote: "a somewhat smaller etc."

Some people need to wake up and smell the coffee!

Thank you Tina!

Michael Beijer Jan 7, 2014:

~ If the interviewer had said 'Hoe kwam u van de top van ING naar het top van XXX',
the interviewer's question would indeed have been neutral. However, they used the word 'topje'. This doesn't necessarily mean that they are implying anything about the smaller company being any less important (although this might actually be the case). However, it does imply something. And this something needs to be captured.

It is often seen as best practice to remain as neutral as possible when translating. However, this can also go too far and I have come across instances where translators actually ended up mistranslating because they sucked all the life out of a text while trying to be as impartial and neutral as possible.

Having said this, I actually think Tina's suggestion ('a (slightly/much) smaller company like XXX') sounds quite good.

Andrew Howitt Jan 7, 2014:

@Barend: a couple of points in response to this:
They say that perception is reality. The only problem with that is that as often as not the reality and the truth can be far apart. You are 'assuming'. In business AND in translation that can be a dangerous thing to do. For a kick-off, in a technical translation you may never make assumptions about what is written in the source text. If you do, you may end up submitting a translation that is wholly incorrect; the same goes for accounting and also legal texts. There can be no discussion about that.

Barend van Zadelhoff Jan 7, 2014:

Andrew It is not about what you find but about what the interviewer implies, even if this is their own personal view of the situation.

Yes, I am assuming it and yes, this is my personal interpretation, which I believe is correct.
Everything we do in translation is making assumptions, this is why it is such a beautiful craft.

If you don't like reading between the lines, you should opt for another profession (not personally meant).
I just mean, a translator needs to be able to read between the lines, this is what translation is all about: understanding your text in every aspect.

What I see many times when translators don't have a good understanding of the subject is that they start to translate 'literally', with the most absurd results.

Tina Vonhof (X) Jan 7, 2014:

Agree with Andrew I would say something like 'a (slightly/much) smaller company like XXX'. The interviewer's question is neutral and we should not read any implied meanings into it.

Michael Beijer Jan 7, 2014:

Hmm. Whoever said it, the meaning is the same as I sketched, and as Barend captured in 'u zat in de top van het ING, wat beweegt u dan om bij zo'n kleintje vergeleen bij ING te gaan werken - dat heeft toch veel minder status ?'

Maybe change 'slightly less impressive' to 'slightly smaller'. Who knows.

It will depend on the type of interviewer. It is not uncommon for famous interviewers to tease their interviewees with loaded questions or comments bordering on the offensive. Most interviewers, however, are not in such positions of power and will probably do their utmost to remain tactful and careful. The trick is to strike the right balance between being tactful and making the interview interesting and worth reading/watching.

Andrew Howitt Jan 7, 2014:

@Barend: it may be 'implied' that it has less status BUT this is NOT specifically said/written. You are assuming it. For one thing, working for a large organization like ING might have status, but working for a smaller financial institute - in certain circumstances - may bring greater status. Think of banks like C. Hoare & Co. or Coutts. If you are at the top of one of them, then I can assure you, you will be held in far greater esteem than with something like ING. Big ain't necessarily everything. As they say "small is beautiful" and can bring far more with it...

Barend van Zadelhoff Jan 7, 2014:

Ik ben het daar niet mee eens.

Het is de interviewer die het woord 'topje' gebruikt.

Wat de interviewer meegeeft is: u zat in de top van het ING, wat beweegt u dan om bij zo'n kleintje vergeleken bij het ING te gaan werken - dat heeft toch veel minder status?

I roughly agree with Michael's interpretation but I would opt for a different translation.

Andrew Howitt Jan 7, 2014:

@Michael: if the business person is worth his salt, in any such business discussion one would NEVER go anywhere near the use of a term that may be construed as negative about a third party not involved in the discussion. Especially so if the discussion is 'exploratory' as you seem to suggest. No sensible business person would do that. It is far too risky and could come back to well and truly bite them in the arse at a later stage.

Michael Beijer Jan 7, 2014:

@Andrew: Maybe. However, Luuk stated 'a significantly smaller institution'. I suppose it will depend on the context. ING is massive, so I doubt 'a somewhat smaller' will suffice here. It looks like the person saying it is trying to make a point about there being quite a difference between this person’s previous and current positions. With 'slightly less impressive', I tried to capture the aspect of saying the person moved to a much less ‘important’ (i.e., prestigious) job, while not stating it too bluntly. I assume this is one businessman talking to another, in confidence.

The other person asks the person: ‘So, tell me, how did you end up going from the top of ING to ...’

Andrew Howitt Jan 7, 2014:

Why not something as simple as "at the head of a somewhat smaller...". The other two comments (relative [should be relatively] insignificant etc.) and slightly less impressive are both negative and effectively disparaging towards the 'new company'. The whole context does not make it any 'less' other than perhaps in size. Hence its credibility should be held intact.

Michael Beijer Jan 7, 2014:

@Petro2: Good point. I think it might be better without them too. I think I added them because Luuk had written '[a significantly smaller institution]', so my brain somehow said: use brackets;)

Barend van Zadelhoff Jan 7, 2014:

Another option ... the top of a relatively insignificant institution like XX

or something like it, just the idea

Petro Ebersöhn (X) Jan 7, 2014:

Michael, I agree with your suggestion. But I do not think the brackets will be necessary.

Michael Beijer Jan 7, 2014:

Hi Luuk, Maybe add something like '(the slightly less impressive)', like this:

'the (slightly less impressive) top of XXX'