May 8, 2017 22:37
7 yrs ago
1 viewer *
Spanish term

que dejan en disminución de agravio

Spanish to English Law/Patents Law (general) criminal, civil
...por ser el posible autor material del delito de lesiones que dejan disminución en agravio del
Señor XXX.

Discussion

AllegroTrans May 9, 2017:
You could... ...ask alot of "what if?" questions here, that's why I suggest keeping the Spanish, with an "explanatory" translation in English. I use this approach whenever there is no sensible direct equivalence.
Sandro Tomasi May 9, 2017:
Wound? What if it is an internal injury?
AllegroTrans May 9, 2017:
@ Robert Yes, not an easy call to get a "universal" English version of "disminución"
Maybe keep the Spanish and give explanation in brackets such as "assault causing bodily harm"
Robert Carter May 9, 2017:
@Sandro. Thanks for the detailed explanation. These "bodily harm" terms are always difficult, for precisely those reasons. I suggest perhaps explaining the Spanish and leaving it to the reader to imagine a suitable equivalent.

@Chris. Wound is fine for "lesión", but what about the rest? There seems to be something more implied here, some aspect of disability or dysfunction, temporary or otherwise. Actually, I'm not even sure about wound, maybe that's still too specific.
AllegroTrans May 9, 2017:
A non state-specific comprehensible-anywhere term? Wounding | Define Wounding at Dictionary.com
www.dictionary.com/browse/wounding
Wounding definition, an injury, usually involving division of tissue or rupture of the integument or mucous membrane, due to external violence or some mechanical agency rather than disease.
Sandro Tomasi May 9, 2017:
@Robert You present valid arguments/questions. Generally speaking, a state-to-state distinction is not necessary. However, the terminological label applied for this particular offense against the person may create some confusion in some state jurisdictions. For example, in some states it is called assault and in others assault is only an “attempt” to injure a person. Battery may include bodily harm in some states or simply be the use of insulting language toward another that impugns his honor. If the translation is for a general audience, sure, let's go with a more general approach.

The federal system vis-à-vis criminal offenses against the person is not the guiding light one would hope for since these charges are mostly brought in state jurisdictions. About 60% of US states follow the Model Penal Code, 30% common law and the rest have a combination of the two and/or something else. But even then, I’m not sure all 60% of the MPC states follow the MPC regarding this type of an offense.
AllegroTrans May 9, 2017:
So maybe... the crime is "causing injury" or "wounding" without trying to get state-sepecific
Robert Carter May 9, 2017:
@Sandro Is what you mention a valid way to approach translation of this kind of term? I'd be interested to know your strategy in those circumstances. Should we try to reach an approximation with what that particular state has on its books or should we find the best English equivalent and translate it as such, even though it might mean slightly different things across different states, and given that the legal systems in the source and target languages are different in any case? Obviously there's a case for favoring one term over another when it comes to different countries, although that's debatable too, but from state to state? How does the US federal court system work regarding those kinds of issues?
Sandro Tomasi May 9, 2017:
It's quite relevant The ST says delito de lesiones, i.e., a crime. "Injuries" is not a crime, rather an element thereof.
AllegroTrans May 9, 2017:
it's irrelevant what state the translation is going to provided the translation is correct. The source text is not from the US in any case.
Sandro Tomasi May 9, 2017:
Vialenguas You say the charge is battery, but do you know that for a fact regarding the state that your translation is destined for? There are a few states where battery does not exist in their penal codes.
Catherine Johanna Ausman Torres (asker) May 9, 2017:
I truly appreciate your time in contributing with your thoughtful and most helpful comments.
Thank you!
Sandro Tomasi May 9, 2017:
Lesiones What state are you translating for? It makes a difference since not all states have the same terminology for this specific offense against the person.
Catherine Johanna Ausman Torres (asker) May 9, 2017:
Charge is battery.
Catherine Johanna Ausman Torres (asker) May 9, 2017:
This is a translation from Spanish to English, of course, into American English usage.
Robert Carter May 9, 2017:
Yes, but what is the charge? Theft, assault...?
Catherine Johanna Ausman Torres (asker) May 9, 2017:
Thank you for your interest and for responding. a criminal case in State Court, USA
Catherine Johanna Ausman Torres (asker) May 9, 2017:
Here is a portion of the text, spoken by the district Attorney:
Señor X, le hago de conocimiento que esta fiscalía le
sigue una investigación por ser el posible autor material del delito de lesiones que dejan disminución en agravio del
Señor YY
Michael Powers (PhD) May 8, 2017:
Please copy the text that precedes and follows what you wrote so that we understand the context. I agree with Allegro and Robert that we do not have enough information to give you a good translation.
AllegroTrans May 8, 2017:
Asker You say "civil, criminal" for subject matter. Exactly what kind of case is this and in which (level of) court in which country?
Robert Carter May 8, 2017:
Hi, I think we may not be possible to give you a good answer here without knowing what the "disminución" refers to. What happened to Señor XXX?

Proposed translations

+1
3 hrs
Spanish term (edited): lesiones que dejan disminución en agravio del Señor XXX
Selected

injuries to Mr. XXX causing him diminished function

You have mis-transcribed the text in the heading to your question - it's "que dejan disminución en agravio".

I believe one phrase is "lesiones que dejan disminución" and another is "en agravio del", meaning "injuries leaving a diminished function in some part of the person's body" and "to the detriment of" respectively.

I left out "to the detriment of" here, substituting it with the phrase "injuries to Mr. XXXX".

Here's another example of the use of the phrase, this time worded as "CUANDO LAS LESIONES PRODUZCAN... DISMINUCIÓN ... DE LAS FUNCIONES, ÓRGANOS O MIEMBROS"
Con fundamento en los numerales 16, párrafos primero y tercero, 21 y 102 Apartado “A” de la Constitución Federal; 141, fracción III, párrafo segundo y cuarto, 142 y 143 todos del Código Nacional de Procedimientos Penales, vengo a solicitar se sirva librar la correspondiente ORDEN DE APREHENSIÓN, en contra de ***** por su probable intervención en el hecho delictuoso tipificado por la ley penal como LESIONES CON MODIFICATIVA AGRAVANTE DE HABERSE COMETIDO CON ARMA DE FUEGO Y CUANDO LAS LESIONES PRODUZCAN DEBILITAMIENTO, DISMINUCIÓN O PERTURBACIÓN DE LAS FUNCIONES, ÓRGANOS O MIEMBROS cometido en agravio de *****, ilícito previsto por el artículo 236 y sancionado por los artículos 237 fracción III, 238 fracciones I y III, en relación con el 6, 7, 8 fracciones I y III; 11 fracción I inciso C) del Código Penal Vigente en el Estado de México.

So I assume your text also relates to the aggravating circumstance mentioned above, codified in the Penal Code, in this example, of the State of Mexico:

IV. Cuando las lesiones produzcan debilitamiento, disminución o perturbación de las funciones, órganos o miembros y con motivo de ello el ofendido quede incapacitado para desarrollar la profesión, arte u oficio que constituía su modo de vivir al momento de ser lesionado, se aplicarán de dos a seis años de prisión y de noventa a doscientos días multa;
http://www.inegi.org.mx/est/contenidos/proyectos/aspectosmet...

Having no idea what part of Mr. XXX's body was injured, I propose translating it with the generic term "diminished function".
Peer comment(s):

agree AllegroTrans : sounds like a good solution
8 hrs
Thanks, Chris, I've a feeling Sandro is about to come up with something better though.
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4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "thank you so very much!"
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