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journalier

English translation: journeyman

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
French term or phrase:journalier
English translation:journeyman
Entered by: Yaotl Altan

15:58 Jun 24, 2008
French to English translations [Non-PRO]
Genealogy
French term or phrase: journalier
I am translating a set of old family records. One is a marriage certificate that states the occupation of the man as a "journalier"...the document is from the late 1830's.

Any ideas????
Rebecca Lyne
France
journeyman
Explanation:
Selected response from:

Yaotl Altan
Mexico
Local time: 07:11
Grading comment
yes, this is correct
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
4 +1journeyman
Yaotl Altan
5agricultural labourer
saraja
4day labourer
translatol
3labourer
Jean-Claude Gouin


  

Answers


1 min   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
journeyman


Explanation:


Yaotl Altan
Mexico
Local time: 07:11
Native speaker of: Native in SpanishSpanish, Native in ItalianItalian
Grading comment
yes, this is correct
Notes to answerer
Asker: Thank you! :-)


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Jennifer Levey: Certainly the most appropriate term for historical documents - and still used today: http://www.skilledworkers.com/employer/job_view.php?id=2533
4 hrs
  -> Thanx!
neutral  translatol: See the note to my answer.
18 hrs
  -> merci :)
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10 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
labourer


Explanation:
*

Jean-Claude Gouin
Canada
Local time: 09:11
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench
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12 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
day labourer


Explanation:
See the Oxford Spanish Dictionary.

'Journalier' originally had the meaning of 'journeyman' (see the Concise Oxford English Dictionary), but I think not by the 1830s.

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Note added at 16 hrs (2008-06-25 08:23:21 GMT)
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'Journeyman' is indeed still in use, as mediamatrix says, but its meaning has changed considerably over time. Today it means "a skilled workman who is employed by another," according to the Concise Oxford English Dictionary, which has a UK bias; this is not necessarily incompatible with the www.skilledworkers reference, which is American. So the question is, what did it mean in 1830 and where? I don't have access to the full Oxford English Dictionary, which is the dictionary one really needs for translating historical documents, though it's available online.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 18 hrs (2008-06-25 10:26:57 GMT)
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The Merriam-Webster (American) adds to the COED definition: "usually by the day." But both dictionaries refer to skill. So if the man in question was a skilled workman, then I would agree that 'journeyman' is probably better than 'day labourer', because 'labourer' implies the opposite.

translatol
Local time: 14:11
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Jennifer Levey: That's what it means, but 'journeyman' was in common use (in the UK at least) until the 2nd World War or even later.
4 hrs
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2 days 2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5
agricultural labourer


Explanation:
ouvrier agricole

saraja
Mauritius
Local time: 17:11
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench
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