Glossary entry (derived from question below)
French term or phrase:
TD NN
English translation:
NN = not assessed
Added to glossary by
Liliana Rogers
Feb 1, 2015 20:07
9 yrs ago
16 viewers *
French term
Same words in different ways
Native in: Romanian 
, English
Works in: English to Romanian, French to English, Romanian to English, and 4 more.
TD NN
French to English
Other
Education / Pedagogy
I have a list of university courses followed by CM, TD and NN. I believe that CM is the equivalent of the professor taught course, TD is (probably?) seminar, but I am completely baffled what is NN supposed to stand for. If anyone is familiar with the French academic notation, I would appreciate your help!
Proposed translations
(English)
| 4 +3 | NN = not assessed |
katsy
|
| 4 | Tutorial Not graded (see below) |
Francois Boye
|
| 3 +1 | travaux dirigés > supervised practical work // teacher to be announced |
Charles Davis
|
References
| TD=tutorial/seminar? |
Yvonne Gallagher
|
Proposed translations
+3
1 hr
Selected
NN = not assessed
NN = non noté - not assessed. I feel pretty sure of this, and will return in a few minutes with a justification other than my certainty!!
Charles is of course right about TD
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Note added at 1 hr (2015-02-01 21:15:46 GMT)
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http://www.telescol.fr/faq/index.php?action=artikel&cat=21&i... - very succinct
slightly better!!
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Note added at 1 hr (2015-02-01 21:16:37 GMT)
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Ah I didn't copy the second reference I see
http://www.telescol.fr/faq/index.php?action=artikel&cat=16&i...
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Note added at 1 hr (2015-02-01 21:31:14 GMT)
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Charles and I are having a lovely exchange on the lines of "after you Cecil, no, after you Claude". Will leave it all to Asker. Am glad to help!
Charles is of course right about TD
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Note added at 1 hr (2015-02-01 21:15:46 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
http://www.telescol.fr/faq/index.php?action=artikel&cat=21&i... - very succinct
slightly better!!
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr (2015-02-01 21:16:37 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Ah I didn't copy the second reference I see
http://www.telescol.fr/faq/index.php?action=artikel&cat=16&i...
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Note added at 1 hr (2015-02-01 21:31:14 GMT)
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Charles and I are having a lovely exchange on the lines of "after you Cecil, no, after you Claude". Will leave it all to Asker. Am glad to help!
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
Charles Davis
: Must be!
33 mins
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Thank you Charles! Yes, it is, I am totally certain, but I do try to justify, I mean why take my word alone? :-)
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| agree |
EirTranslations
13 hrs
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Thanks Aquamarine :-)
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| agree |
Yvonne Gallagher
14 hrs
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Thanks Gallagy :-)
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4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "Thank you all!"
1 hr
Francois Boye
United States
United States
Native in French
United States
An economic geek with social skills
Native in: French 
Works in: English to French, French to English, Spanish to English, and 1 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
47
Tutorial Not graded (see below)
A "TD" is a session of teaching under the authority of an assistant professor. This session includes a small group of students (less than 50). It allows students to deepen their understanding of lectures delivered in large lecture halls. The assistant professor is an non Ph.D, holder; he is part of a pedagogical team headed by the full professor who delivers teaching in lecture halls.
NN means not assessed, i.e., not graded by the assistant professor.
NN means not assessed, i.e., not graded by the assistant professor.
+1
52 mins
travaux dirigés > supervised practical work // teacher to be announced
TD is undoubtedly travaux dirigés, for which "seminars" and "tutorials" have previously been suggested here:
http://www.proz.com/kudoz/french_to_english/education_pedago...
http://www.proz.com/kudoz/french_to_english/education_pedago...
But descriptions I read of TD in French universities don't sound exactly like either of these things to me. Tutorials are essentially a dialogue between one or two students and the teacher. Seminars are group discussions. But TD really involve the student doing practical work guided by the teacher. I think the Collins dictionary suggested of supervised practical work is about right. But this can no doubt be endlessly debated.
NN: no sign anywhere of this as a form of teaching. But it does appear in French university course handbooks as a placeholder for the name of the teacher, evidently meaning that it has not yet been determined who will teach this particular part of the course. So that might be it.
For example:
"5e semestre
NN – cours 1h, TD 2h"
[...]
5e semestre
M. Nicolas COURTIN – cours 1h, TD 1h"
http://www.icp.fr/fr/content/download/11243/164884/version/1...
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Note added at 2 hrs (2015-02-01 22:52:07 GMT)
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I do see your point! I hadn't registered the fact that it's a transcript. Anyway, katsy has suggested what I think must be the correct meaning of NN.
http://www.proz.com/kudoz/french_to_english/education_pedago...
http://www.proz.com/kudoz/french_to_english/education_pedago...
But descriptions I read of TD in French universities don't sound exactly like either of these things to me. Tutorials are essentially a dialogue between one or two students and the teacher. Seminars are group discussions. But TD really involve the student doing practical work guided by the teacher. I think the Collins dictionary suggested of supervised practical work is about right. But this can no doubt be endlessly debated.
NN: no sign anywhere of this as a form of teaching. But it does appear in French university course handbooks as a placeholder for the name of the teacher, evidently meaning that it has not yet been determined who will teach this particular part of the course. So that might be it.
For example:
"5e semestre
NN – cours 1h, TD 2h"
[...]
5e semestre
M. Nicolas COURTIN – cours 1h, TD 1h"
http://www.icp.fr/fr/content/download/11243/164884/version/1...
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Note added at 2 hrs (2015-02-01 22:52:07 GMT)
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I do see your point! I hadn't registered the fact that it's a transcript. Anyway, katsy has suggested what I think must be the correct meaning of NN.
Note from asker:
| I thought about this as well, you are right. My problem is that I don't see what would be the point to list the name of the teacher in a transcript? Besides, this is a course taken in the 12-13 academic year - you would expect them to have figured out the name of the teacher by now! Thank you for your effort, but I am still looking! |
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
katsy
: I would say "seminar" precisely because the number of students is often a lot more than one or two! I've placed my own answer for NN;only afterwards did I think about the pb of points. They should be for you//Am certain for NN but you were 1st for TD :-)
17 mins
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Thanks, katsy, but your suggestion for NN seems more plausible :) // No, no, not at all! The problem here was NN and you have solved it, I am sure. TD was easy (give or take the translation!).
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| neutral |
Yvonne Gallagher
: "TD" been answered countless times but I don't like "seminars". TP=PW & Katsy right with NN//I didn't realise UK difference here. Just did bit of Googling but now have to do some work:-)
15 hrs
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Yes, Katsy's right about NN, as I've already said. I have doubts about seminars too, though it's better than tutorials, which is quite wrong for British English (not sure about Ireland). Should be a term applicable to a group class.
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Reference comments
17 hrs
Yvonne Gallagher
Ireland
Ireland
Native in English
Specializes in field
Ireland
right word, right place. everytime
Native in: English (Variants: US, Canadian, Irish, UK)
Works in: French to English, Spanish to English, English, and 1 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
112
Reference:
TD=tutorial/seminar?
In the university context I think "tutorial" more often refers to a tutorial group or class as obviously resources wouldn't stretch these days to giving one-on-one tuition (though it says in Wikipedia this still takes place in Oxbridge and some other universities. Is this true? Can anyone confirm?)
HOWEVER, this view stems from my personal experience in Ireland and Canada where the "tutorial" is a class group of 10-50 (depending on size of class) where aspects of the previous lecture(s) are teased out in more detail between director/superviser (normally one of the course lecturers or more rarely, a PhD candidate) who calls on people for their views and there is definite interaction and debate.
The UK is different?
In Manchester what I know of as a tutorial (class) is called a "seminar" it seems
http://www.humanities.manchester.ac.uk/studyskills/develop_l...
and in Nottingham "tutorial" may be a group or individual
http://www.nottingham.ac.uk/studyingeffectively/teaching/tut...
Most transcripts I've translated have TD and TP so obviously it would be confusing to say "PW" twice so I usually use (D)TW for TD and explain it in key/legend as "(Directed) tutorial work". Sometime there is no space for the "D" so just left as "TW"
I've never had anyone complain but now I would consider using "Directed seminar work or DSW for UK
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tutorial
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seminar
http://www.theguardian.com/higher-education-network/blog/201...
So, as usual in the field of educational equivalence, it is really important to know the source AND target countries as there is so much diversity
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Note added at 22 hrs (2015-02-02 18:51:17 GMT)
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Yes, we had individual tutors in my first alma mater TCD but these tutors were there for pastoral advice only i.e. acting in loco parentis.
I had a look at the English course outlines and a change has taken place it seems as now the 1st two years use a combination of lectures and tutorials whereas in final two years it's seminars! In my day there were around 100 at a lecture (in undergraduate English) and 8-12 students at a tutorial
"The School of English is strongly committed to small-group teaching. In the first two years teaching is by a combination of lectures and related tutorials. Lectures will typically have a maximum of around 50 students. All Freshman (first and second year) lecture modules are supported by small-group teaching dedicated to that module only, and the numbers for tutorials are around 12 students. In the Sophister (third and fourth) years, most English modules are chosen by students from a wide range of available options, and most are taught through seminar discussion. There is a maximum of around 22 students in each seminar. .."
HOWEVER, this view stems from my personal experience in Ireland and Canada where the "tutorial" is a class group of 10-50 (depending on size of class) where aspects of the previous lecture(s) are teased out in more detail between director/superviser (normally one of the course lecturers or more rarely, a PhD candidate) who calls on people for their views and there is definite interaction and debate.
The UK is different?
In Manchester what I know of as a tutorial (class) is called a "seminar" it seems
http://www.humanities.manchester.ac.uk/studyskills/develop_l...
and in Nottingham "tutorial" may be a group or individual
http://www.nottingham.ac.uk/studyingeffectively/teaching/tut...
Most transcripts I've translated have TD and TP so obviously it would be confusing to say "PW" twice so I usually use (D)TW for TD and explain it in key/legend as "(Directed) tutorial work". Sometime there is no space for the "D" so just left as "TW"
I've never had anyone complain but now I would consider using "Directed seminar work or DSW for UK
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tutorial
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seminar
http://www.theguardian.com/higher-education-network/blog/201...
So, as usual in the field of educational equivalence, it is really important to know the source AND target countries as there is so much diversity
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 22 hrs (2015-02-02 18:51:17 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Yes, we had individual tutors in my first alma mater TCD but these tutors were there for pastoral advice only i.e. acting in loco parentis.
I had a look at the English course outlines and a change has taken place it seems as now the 1st two years use a combination of lectures and tutorials whereas in final two years it's seminars! In my day there were around 100 at a lecture (in undergraduate English) and 8-12 students at a tutorial
"The School of English is strongly committed to small-group teaching. In the first two years teaching is by a combination of lectures and related tutorials. Lectures will typically have a maximum of around 50 students. All Freshman (first and second year) lecture modules are supported by small-group teaching dedicated to that module only, and the numbers for tutorials are around 12 students. In the Sophister (third and fourth) years, most English modules are chosen by students from a wide range of available options, and most are taught through seminar discussion. There is a maximum of around 22 students in each seminar. .."
Peer comments on this reference comment:
| agree |
Charles Davis
: Not worth a note; just to confirm that individual tutorials (called supervisions in Cambridge) still survive in Oxbridge, and in other Br univs the term means the same but tutorials are much less frequent. Tutorial work/tutorial group could be OK though.
1 hr
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yes, differences between countries and between schools mean it's hard to be exact...
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Discussion
I can help you improve your translation of CM and TD.. But I need more information on NN to help you.