Glossary entry

English term or phrase:

surrender its stale connotations

Spanish translation:

la rosa nunca abandonó sus connotaciones marchitas/pasadas

Added to glossary by Carmen Schultz
May 29, 2009 08:04
15 yrs ago
English term

surrender its stale connotations

English to Spanish Other Psychology
But no matter how hard Gertrude Stein tried..., her words refused to become meaningless. The rose never surrendered its stale connotations.

¿Me podéis explicar la frase?
Gracias
Change log

Jun 2, 2009 06:55: Carmen Schultz Created KOG entry

Proposed translations

+2
7 mins
Selected

la rosa nunca abandonó sus connotaciones marchitas/pasadas

es una forma de decirlo

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Note added at 1 hr (2009-05-29 09:10:42 GMT)
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Se refiere a la famosa estrofa " A rose is a rose is a rose" del poema de G. Stein "Sacred Emily" de 1913. El lenguaje repetitivo de G. Stein's se refiere a la naturaleza cambiante del lenguaje dentro de la historia y el tiempo.

De Wikipedia:
"...The sentence "Rose is a rose is a rose is a rose." was written by Gertrude Stein as part of the 1913 poem Sacred Emily, which appeared in the 1922 book Geography and Plays. In that poem, the first "Rose" is the name of a person. Stein later used variations on the sentence in other writings, and "A rose is a rose is a rose" is probably her most famous quote, often interpreted as meaning "things are what they are," a statement of the law of identity, "A is A". In Stein's view, the sentence expresses the fact that simply using the name of a thing already invokes the imagery and emotions associated with it. As the quote diffused through her own writing, and the culture at large, Stein once remarked "Now listen! I’m no fool. I know that in daily life we don’t go around saying 'is a … is a … is a …' Yes, I’m no fool; but I think that in that line the rose is red for the first time in English poetry for a hundred years." (Four in America) [1]

Gertrude Stein's repetitive language can be said to refer to the changing quality of language in time and history. She herself said to an audience at Oxford University that the statement referred to the fact that when the Romantics used the word "rose" it had a direct relationship to an actual rose. For later periods in literature this would no longer be true. The eras following romanticism, notably the modern era, use the word rose to refer to the actual rose, yet they also imply, through the use of the word, the archetypical elements of the romantic era. It also follows the rhetoric law of thricefold repetition to emphasize a point, as can be seen in speeches dating back to the sophists."
Peer comment(s):

agree Rafael Molina Pulgar : Se me ocurre: ... sus rancias connotaciones.
1 hr
gracias
agree jacana54 (X) : ¡Qué buena explicación, Carmen!
3 hrs
gracias mil
Something went wrong...
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
+3
52 mins

la rosa siguió teniendo cierto aire marchito/ rancio// conservó sus connotaciones marchitas/ rancias

Habría que tener más contexto para ver el registro que mejor encaja
Peer comment(s):

agree Ismael Gómez : me gusta la primera idea
2 mins
Gracias, Ismael - Bea
agree nahuelhuapi
1 hr
Gracias, Nahuelhuapi - Bea
agree Christine Walsh
4 hrs
Thanks, Christine - Bea
Something went wrong...
4 hrs

(nunca) exhaló su disipado aroma

"Stein's writing appears on three different planes: her hermetic works that have gone largely unread, ...
After moving to Paris in 1903, she started to write in earnest: novels, plays, stories, libretti and poems. Increasingly, she developed her own highly idiosyncratic, playful, sometimes repetitive and sometimes humorous style. Typical quotes are: ***"Rose is a rose is a rose is a rose";..." ***
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gertrude_Stein


Definiciones de surrender en la web en inglés:
* resignation: acceptance of despair
* giving up: a verbal act of admitting defeat
* give up or agree to forgo to the power or possession of another; "The last Taleban fighters finally surrendered"
* the delivery of a principal into lawful custody
* relinquish possession or control over; "The squatters had to surrender the building after the police moved in"
* capitulation: the act of surrendering (usually under agreed conditions); "they were protected until the capitulation of the fort"
wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn


:)
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5 hrs

nunca cedió su antigua connotación

No me gusta demasiado el adjetivo, habría que buscar uno que diera la idea de trillado y viejo a la vez, pero creo que en el breve contexto pareciera que se trata de un análisis o aventura sobre qué es o qué forma significados, tomando como un ejemplo el carácter repetitivo de Stein en su escritura (Ojo! que no es Stein la que escribe) y que la repetición casi obsesiva de un término puede acabar vaciándolo de significado asible. Sin embargo, la rosa no cede. Repetida hasta el hartazgo sigue siendo rosa en su más prosaico significado.
Ojalá ayude

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Note added at 5 hrs (2009-05-29 13:46:06 GMT)
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Ahora pienso que "resistir" podría ser el verbo.
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