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  3. Philosophy

faire l’épreuve

English translation: experiencing

22:04 Jun 25, 2015
French to English translations [PRO]
Philosophy
French term or phrase: faire l’épreuve
From an academic text on Averroism:

L’averroïsme ne dit pas, évidemment : « l’homme ne pense pas ». Les averroïstes demandent : qu’appelle-t-on penser ? qu’est-ce que l’homme ? quel rapport, par exemple, entre pensée, et expérience de la pensée ? De quoi ***fais-je l’épreuve*** quand j’assure, le cas échéant, que je m’éprouve pensant ?
tatyana000
Local time: 20:56
English translation:experiencing
Explanation:
This produces the apparently tautologous "What am I experiencing when... I experience myself thinking?" ("De quoi fais-je l'épreuve quand... je m'éprouve pensant?") but perhaps this can be worked around.

The contrast is between the WHAT that is the object of my thought (la pensée) - and the subjective side of thought - the experience of thought (l'expérience de la pensée).

This is expressed in the French in the difference between "faire l'épreuve de", where an experience is the basis of an objective judgement ("Action d'éprouver, opération à l'aide de laquelle on juge si une chose a la qualité que nous lui croyons") and "éprouver", where experience is just a subjective feeling.

Ie the first "experience" is the sense of something being "testified to", you could, eg. say "what is being testified to when I experience myself thinking", but I find that awkward and a bit off and it loses the subtlety that is being expressed: the duality of experience, its two 'sides', one inside the other.

I suggest enhancing the distinction by translating the "éprouver" as "feeling" - "What am I experiencing when I feel myself thinking?" - perhaps also italicising the "what" and trusting that the context makes the contrast clear... but it is tricky!
Selected response from:

Melissa McMahon
Australia
Local time: 04:56
Grading comment
Thank you! I really like your suggestion: "What am I experiencing when... I experience myself thinking?" -- very clear and concise.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
4 +2to experience/perceive
philgoddard
3 +2experiencing
Melissa McMahon


  

Answers


25 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +2
to experience/perceive


Explanation:
'Faire l'épreuve d'une chose, en essayer.
"Assurer par là [par des dévotions à Marie] son salut avec tant de certitude que ceux qui en font l'épreuve n'y ont jamais été trompés, de quelque manière qu'ils aient vécu, quoique nous conseillions de ne laisser pas de bien vivre". [Pascal, Les provinciales]'

Whichever word you choose, you should avoid repeating "experience", which is used in the previous sentence. So I would translate one as "experience" and one as "perceive".


    Reference: http://littre.reverso.net/dictionnaire-francais/definition/%...
philgoddard
United States
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 16

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Melissa McMahon: We came to similar conclusions, I didn't see your answer until I submitted mine!/Similar, not identical.
29 mins
  -> If it was the other way around, I'd delete my answer and agree with yours.
agree  Charles Davis: Experience is the only valid option, IMO; perceive is not the same thing at all. Repetition in philosophical texts is not to be avoided per se, and the repetition is in the original. // NO!! Absolutely not. They overlap but are by no means coterminous.
8 hrs
  -> Thanks for agreeing, but our experience of something is our perception of it.
agree  erwan-l: Definitely not "perceive" (irrelevant, even false), but "experience": yes indeed.
8 hrs
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

53 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +2
experiencing


Explanation:
This produces the apparently tautologous "What am I experiencing when... I experience myself thinking?" ("De quoi fais-je l'épreuve quand... je m'éprouve pensant?") but perhaps this can be worked around.

The contrast is between the WHAT that is the object of my thought (la pensée) - and the subjective side of thought - the experience of thought (l'expérience de la pensée).

This is expressed in the French in the difference between "faire l'épreuve de", where an experience is the basis of an objective judgement ("Action d'éprouver, opération à l'aide de laquelle on juge si une chose a la qualité que nous lui croyons") and "éprouver", where experience is just a subjective feeling.

Ie the first "experience" is the sense of something being "testified to", you could, eg. say "what is being testified to when I experience myself thinking", but I find that awkward and a bit off and it loses the subtlety that is being expressed: the duality of experience, its two 'sides', one inside the other.

I suggest enhancing the distinction by translating the "éprouver" as "feeling" - "What am I experiencing when I feel myself thinking?" - perhaps also italicising the "what" and trusting that the context makes the contrast clear... but it is tricky!



    Reference: http://littre.reverso.net/dictionnaire-francais/definition/%...
Melissa McMahon
Australia
Local time: 04:56
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 86
Grading comment
Thank you! I really like your suggestion: "What am I experiencing when... I experience myself thinking?" -- very clear and concise.

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  erwan-l
7 hrs
  -> Thanks erwan!
agree  Yvonne Gallagher
9 hrs
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